Black 21

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nickersonm
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Re: Black 21

Post by nickersonm » Tue Nov 20, 2012 8:17 pm

Ludovsky wrote:... what happened to the Refugees, and what were they actually fleeing from in that retrofitted asteroid of theirs that served as their mothership? Especially as lore do says they did come up to human space, they get a planet to settle.... then somehow without any reasons just up and went again.

Perhaps the cylons? Then they moved on when the cylons started getting closer.

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fibio
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Re: Black 21

Post by fibio » Tue Nov 20, 2012 11:30 pm

Perhaps they've finally realised that the meteors have been striking with a touch too much precision.
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vaccum_pony
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Re: Black 21

Post by vaccum_pony » Wed Nov 21, 2012 1:08 am

The Swarm is evolving. They've learned to be subtle and are using their basic resource (asteroids) in new ways.
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SFS Lovenought
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Re: Black 21

Post by SFS Lovenought » Wed Nov 21, 2012 2:14 am

vaccum_pony wrote:The Swarm is evolving. They've learned to be subtle and are using their basic resource (asteroids) in new ways.


Hmmmm, that does make sense, except the Swarm are not real AI's, just expert systems like the VN.
It would be almost impossible for them to gain and use that ability as a result of random evolution.

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vaccum_pony
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Re: Black 21

Post by vaccum_pony » Wed Nov 21, 2012 2:18 am

Oops. Posted in wrong topic. Should stop opening multiple tabs while distracted.
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ignus
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Re: Black 21

Post by ignus » Thu Nov 22, 2012 11:21 am

Erinys wrote:Sometimes a Black Designation is given when a familiar enemy appears in an unfamiliar form.

--Arinn

I always assumed that Black 21 was the first time they got a clear look at a Suul'ka.

cakedaemon
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Re: Black 21

Post by cakedaemon » Fri Nov 23, 2012 10:57 pm

I always guessed that it may have been the Xombie plague on a large scale outbreak through the trade system or something.

I'm probably wrong, though.

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Ludovsky
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Re: Black 21

Post by Ludovsky » Sat Nov 24, 2012 3:54 am

Erinys wrote:Sometimes a Black Designation is given when a familiar enemy appears in an unfamiliar form.

--Arinn


Ok, this is (possibly) a strong hint here.
A familiar enemy, in an unfamiliar form.

So, let's put this simply, this is something we have already seen before. And if you want my opinion, this is probably not an AI, as the loas are already there, but would be most redundant already.

This leave two major possibilities:
A-A random encounter or grand menaces prove itself to be but the point of an incoming iceberg. This can be something that is already there, like the proteans, though something like the proteans feels unlikely as they have no Black designation yets nor has there been hints they are related to Black 21 either yet... though it may still be possible. Quite likely, it may be something we've already encountered in SOTS1 but has been absent sofar in SOTS2 for varied reasons. Good examples of this particular category would be the refugees, the Peacekeeper or the Puppetmaster. All SOTS1 encounters which have yet to return(were they "defeated", did they just "disapear" like the Refugees?).

B- Note the wording of "familiar in an unfamiliar form". Something familiar might not have made it on the black list, or be known for so long as to be barely considered a "Black" item anymore.
Like one of the current races. Which leaves two very strong contenders:
-The Silver Imperium, or the descendant of it's lost remnants at least, changed by distance and whatever made them disapear from known space altogether.
-Modified Hivers: It's been said that Hivers colonial efforts extended to before the development of gates at all. This generally ended in disaster, but similarly it was said some colonies might have survived. Now, it's also been said Hivers have a penchant for self-modifications when it comes to tackling new environment and challenges("under an unfamiliar form").
Similarly, a princess who is cut off from the Queen and other princesses long enough might also be able to evolve into a Queen herself.
And now... nothing say that if such a splinter group of Hivers, who would have evolved/modified themselves differently from other Hivers, evolved their own Queen... would stick to the One Queen Only rule of the traditional empire("The beginning of the End" would be a nice way of describing the conjoint invasion from the forces of not one, but -multiple- , possibly allied, space ages Hivers Queen who would have been able to develop their own fully fledged civilizations away from known spaces for hundred or thousands of years(depending on just how long hivers have been around in space). Recalling the first Hivers wars, imagine if you multiplied the whole of Hivers forces by two... or ten?).
I don't know for you, but I cannot help but picture the image of a swarm of Locusts coming to reap one's world of ressources to feeds their billions of hungry mouth.

Just food for thoughts. I cannot help but feel the Hivers hypothesis would have potential, but then that's just me liking this theory in general even after the Loas were proven as the new race for the current expansion.
Last edited by Ludovsky on Sat Nov 24, 2012 3:58 am, edited 1 time in total.

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marshb
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Re: Black 21

Post by marshb » Sat Nov 24, 2012 3:58 am

I think we saw A in the Loa intro movie; The Protean Worldship(?). Mecron stated it is a One of a Kind Craft.
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SFS Lovenought
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Re: Black 21

Post by SFS Lovenought » Sat Nov 24, 2012 4:31 am

I was thinking, what if the beggining of the end is not a bad thing?
At the end of the second Lord of the Rings movie Gandalfs return could be called the beggining of the end.
Maybe the Loa showing up like big goddam heroes is the beggining of the end of this era?

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Ludovsky
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Re: Black 21

Post by Ludovsky » Sat Nov 24, 2012 5:48 pm

Something that sound as unique as a Worldship though feels like it'd make a better grand menace than new factions.

Then again nobody said Black 21 would be a new faction.

If anything, I do have to say that I now cannot help but imagine the idea of a computer-controlled Super Faction, that could be toggled on and off like a grand menace but be an option of their own.

A faction that would "appear" in the game akin to a grand menace, but unlike a grand menace could actually conquer worlds after worlds, producing new "ships" and units to attack the player with, with incredible power at it's disposal.... akin to a "super faction", but one uncontrolled by players. Something like a "super grand menace", beings of precursors level of technology yet not a mere shard or remnant of it but the full might of it, coming to claim "it's" rightful place in the universe, everyone having no other choices but to fight them or die trying.

Also, someone like Baron Samedi feels more like "Crazy psychopath" than "big damn hero" for most carbonites who must have had to fight him. On the other hand, many "Big Damn Heroes" for us would probably fit the same bill, and there are certainly some -loas- for whom he is a "Big Damn Hero".

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Aedrion
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Re: Black 21

Post by Aedrion » Sat Nov 24, 2012 7:01 pm

Ludovsky wrote:Something that sound as unique as a Worldship though feels like it'd make a better grand menace than new factions.

Then again nobody said Black 21 would be a new faction.

If anything, I do have to say that I now cannot help but imagine the idea of a computer-controlled Super Faction, that could be toggled on and off like a grand menace but be an option of their own.

A faction that would "appear" in the game akin to a grand menace, but unlike a grand menace could actually conquer worlds after worlds, producing new "ships" and units to attack the player with, with incredible power at it's disposal.... akin to a "super faction", but one uncontrolled by players. Something like a "super grand menace", beings of precursors level of technology yet not a mere shard or remnant of it but the full might of it, coming to claim "it's" rightful place in the universe, everyone having no other choices but to fight them or die trying.

Also, someone like Baron Samedi feels more like "Crazy psychopath" than "big damn hero" for most carbonites who must have had to fight him. On the other hand, many "Big Damn Heroes" for us would probably fit the same bill, and there are certainly some -loas- for whom he is a "Big Damn Hero".


This could be true.

There are many things that could become a super race. And tbh, I love the idea of having one such race on the map, would make forming alliances and fighting together a real priority. And give us a chance to use those super awesome top-notch weapons on something that can take it >=)

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Heart of Storm
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Re: Black 21

Post by Heart of Storm » Sun Nov 25, 2012 11:06 am

I'm inclined to believe that 'a familiar enemy in an unfamiliar form' is probably not one of the less frequently encountered blacklist entries (such as the refugees who I really feel are a dead end).

By definition a 'familiar enemy' needs to be familiar, something the refugees are not..

My first instinct was for the Von Neumanns, however any of the Grand menaces would also fit (and in fact the Puppet Master would be something quite interesting to see in the wake of the Loa...)

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That Schmuck
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Re: Black 21

Post by That Schmuck » Sun Nov 25, 2012 5:09 pm

Iunno, I've been suspecting for the last week that Black 21's description is short for "The beginning of the end... of flesh." Certainly the loa would be a familiar enemy in an unfamiliar form. And it's not like this would be the first time a faction, or members of a faction, got its own Black designation. But I'm usually wrong about my speculation, so I wouldn't be surprised if that's the case here.

EDIT: And I just checked back a page or 2 to find that it's definitely not the loa. Doh!

saral
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Re: Black 21

Post by saral » Sun Nov 25, 2012 10:15 pm

I'm expecting Stellar Generation Prime to arrive in an expansion to SOTS 3. It's the one high tech faction that is supposed to be around, and probably isn't too happy with the plagues this area has released on the Galaxy. (Suul'ka, Zuul, and Loa). It managed to survive its encounter with it's Suul'ka by an expert system. - The Peacekeeper. Cutting out the cancerous cells and forcing the war into remission.

Now it knows where the Suul'ka came from.

We also know the Tarka silver imperium fell, and originally had a different drive. So Tarka are a possibilty. Basically cut off, developed the remnants differently.

Zuul - unlikely. but also different drive originally

This might not be the first Liir rebellion. Technology might have developed differently there.

Von Neumann. several clues that this homeworld might not be the only one.
I would caution in the use of "the" in regards to the VN HW...perhaps "a" is a more accurate choice. — Mecron
basically...a world sized microchip — Mecron

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